Re: free speech on the extrope list( was: Re: Precisions on the Martinot situation)

From: Eliezer S. Yudkowsky (sentience@pobox.com)
Date: Fri Jul 25 2003 - 04:49:24 MDT

  • Next message: Robert J. Bradbury: "Re: free speech on the extrope list"

    Lee Corbin wrote:
    >
    >>when he raised nuclear genocide as a possible rational and
    >>*morally preferable* option was the revolted reaction of a
    >>friend who, out of politeness, did not wish to say publicly
    >>what Eliezer said: `Are you autistic?'
    >
    > That's a pretty dumb question! Like your probable remarks,
    > it does far more to connote a frame of mind (a rather
    > deplorable frame of mind IMO) than it does to advance
    > rational discussion.

    Perhaps it does not advance rational discussion. It was a serious
    question, though. The disconnect between the words being verbally
    manipulated into sentence streams, and all affect, emotion, intuitive
    visualization, was large enough to make me start wondering about Robert's
    sanity, or at least such small sanity as humans are supposed to have.

    The Hiroshima bomber crew did not, contrary to legend, have nightmares
    about it. They flew back, Truman told them that he took responsibility,
    and that was that. Can you imagine if they'd had to walk along a line of
    seventy thousand people and, one by one, slit their throats - let alone
    being forced to burn them in fire? One by one, letting each soldier or
    man or woman or schoolchild finish dying before moving on to the next?
    They would not have gotten past the first ten, they would have had
    nightmares for the rest of their lives, and if Truman told them he
    "accepted full responsibility" it would have been a pathetic, useless
    token. Dave Grossman is exactly right; technological distance is
    emotional distance. Bomber crews don't have nightmares because they wield
    buttons instead of knives, though the suffering they cause is vastly greater.

    Robert Bradbury has no goddamn idea what the words coming out of his mouth
    actually mean. That much is clear. And similarly the people who dropped
    the bomb on Hiroshima had no goddamn idea what that button actually did,
    regardless of what verbal ideas were floating around in their heads. Hugo
    de Garis has no goddamn idea of what a 'gigadeath' 'artilect war' would
    involve, and Ben Goertzel has no goddamn idea that AI is an existential
    risk, regardless of what words they put down on paper. Being unable to
    relate abstract verbal thought to negative affect is not a charming
    personal quirk. Robert is just emotionally disconnected from the results
    of what he's saying, not evil; he has no idea that he might be doing
    something wrong, though he realizes in a distant way that he ought to
    acknowledge the possibility. But y'know, by golly, I bet that when all
    the bodies are counted up across the galaxies, it's the Roberts and not
    the Hitlers who account for most of the planetary kills. There comes a
    point where stupidity stops being innocent, and it doesn't really matter
    anymore whether you have to be emotionally evil as well as verbally evil
    to genuinely be a bad person. I think that line is crossed when you start
    talking about the use of nuclear weapons to commit genocide against those
    darn foreigners because paying attention would be too inconvenient.

    -- 
    Eliezer S. Yudkowsky                          http://singinst.org/
    Research Fellow, Singularity Institute for Artificial Intelligence
    


    This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Fri Jul 25 2003 - 05:00:27 MDT