Re: [POLITICS] Re: Libertarian theory breaking down (was Re: [WAR]: Does

From: mlorrey@yahoo.com
Date: Sun Mar 23 2003 - 13:50:35 MST

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    From: "Michael S. Lorrey" <mlorrey@yahoo.com>
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    [quote from: Samantha on 2003-03-23 at 12:27:17]
    I thought it was our goal to create a world or pockets therein of maximum
    extropy. I don't see how those pockets can be created without maximizing
    freedom and individual rights.

    Neither can I, but I didn't expect Samantha to say this. The primary problem I
    see is that so many make such an assumption but then abdicate by claiming that
    such can only be created by peaceful means. Freedom has just about never been
    achieved by peaceful means, the only two instances I can think of for such
    occured exclusively within the anglosphere (South Africa and India).

    Extropy may be for spontaneous order, but order in and of itself is
    not necessarily extropic, it is frequently stasist in nature, and the
    calcification endemic to extended order frequently requires a little creative
    destruction to enable a renewal of extropic forces.

    Given that there really is no place in the world of 'savage wilderness' in the
    Lockean sense to create a new extropic/libertarian utopia, such a society can
    only be created by supplanting/destroying/transforming an existing order in
    an existing society. A large degree of this has already occured in the last
    decade with the transformative influence of the internet.

    In this respect, extropy has largely succeeded in its most easily obtainable
    objectives. At the present time, however, we are restrained from building
    an even freer society by the security threats posed by terrorist groups and
    states that retain power, wealth, and influence and have declared themselves
    to be enemies of the sort of world that extropians have stated they want to
    build.

    We are for civilian cryptography, but it is used to hide terrorist
    communications. We are for data havens, nanotech, and freely available
    biotech research. We are for civilian space exploration, as well as many
    other things. All of these are under threat of restriction because of
    the threat of terrorism and insurgencies by rogue states holding the
    world hostage. Libertarian societies do not deal well with terrorist
    insurgencies. They require a commonality of belief in libertarian principles
    by all members of such societies. In order to build such a society, we must
    first make the world safe enough that most people can feel secure in the free
    exercise of such liberties.

    Groups like al Qaeda and governments like Iraq and North Korea, as extreme
    examples, stand foursquare against extropy and liberty. While there are many
    other oppositionist groups and governments in the world that will stand in the
    way of extropy and libertarian principles, these are the most eggregious.

    Claiming to be high minded in taking a passive stance is simply facetious
    hypocrisy. Inaction in pursuit of extropy is no virtue, to paraphrase
    Cato. Simply sitting idly by and waiting for such states to collapse is simply
    pollyannish.

    ----
    This message was posted by Michael S. Lorrey to the Extropians 2003 board on ExI BBS.
    <http://www.extropy.org/bbs/index.php?board=67;action=display;threadid=55266>
    


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