From: Aditya Tyagi (aditya_tyagi@yahoo.com)
Date: Wed Mar 12 2003 - 13:59:19 MST
*APPLAUSE TO ARTILLO*
It's about time someone told Ron H. to his face like
it is. Thank you very much, Artillo! I've not been on
this group all that long, but I surmise there are far
more lurkers than posters, with Ron H. definitely
being one of the more frequent posters. After reading
his posts for some time now, I'm convinced his
knowledge of world history is pretty limited and he
likes it to be that way. Everything has to be
American-centric and if anyone disagrees, he's quick
to label them "anti-American". He seems to be able to
think in terms of only black and white without seeing
the many shades of gray on various
socio/political/economic/etc issues that are extremely
complex. For a man of his experience, education, and
age, it's sad that people can be so dumb in this day
and age.
Thanks again, Artillo.
aditya
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 17:16:52 EST
From: Artillo5@cs.com
Subject: Re:PEACE?: Gotta love those polls! (NOT
really about IRAQ)
In a message dated 03/11/2003 2:17:16 PM Eastern
Standard Time,
Dehede011@aol.com writes:
<< In a message dated 3/11/2003 12:32:08 PM Central
Standard Time,
Artillo5@cs.com writes: What *I* want to see is an
international poll to see
what percentage of people in the world think that if
the international
community fails to act firmly now against the UNITED
STATES, then the world
will become a more dangerous place in years to come?
Arti,
None of that matters. What counts is that the
US is the one that has
been shot at, hit, lost citizenry/visitors, and is
being aimed at again.
That you wish to knock off the US, aren't concerned
with American loss of
life and don't like us anyway means nothing.
Have a good day,
Ron h.
>>
Ron,
Up until now I have refrained from responding on any
of your commentary thus
far, but I think this one takes the cake and is
deserving of a reply.Your
obvious lack of reading comprehension skills and
penchant for putting words
in people's mouths makes you sound like more of a
buffoon than ever before.
Point #1: I think that the opinion of the world's
human beings matters very
much. Unfortunately, there will never be a completely
honest representation
of people's opinions in any poll for obvious reasons.
Point #2: Nowhere in my post did I EVER state that I
"wish[ed] to knock off
the US" as you seem to think I did. I think I stated
my intentions rather
plainly in the original post. Read more carefully next
time.
Point #3: I am not only concerned with the loss of
American lives, but the
lives of EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING ON THE PLANET. If
war can be averted at any
cost then THAT is the road we need to take for
HUMANITY'S sake. We need to
stop slaughtering eachother over bullshit ideological,
religious, or
otherwise dogmatic reasons.
Point #4: I think you have the misconception that I am
not an American
Citizen. The only kinds of people I dislike are
ignorant, close-minded, and
blindly patriotic, but... this is America and everyone
is entitled to their
opinion as long as it's not forced down our throats.
Would I be better off as
a citizen of another country? I surely don't know.
Ron, why exactly are you still on this list? It seems
to me that much of the
rhetoric I have seen you spouting off recently seems
to have very little with
core Extropian values and a lot to do with you being
pissed off at the way
the world is today. YES I agree with you, the world is
a pretty messed up
place, YES there are lots and lots of bad people out
there, and YES there are
many forms of injustice out there, however, I do NOT
agree with ANY
government who decides to KILL to support their own
brand of dogma, INCLUDING
the United States. I also am very disconcerted about
the direction the
current US administration and it's agents are taking
this country are taking
in regards to our civil liberties. I don't think I
have to lecture you on the
importance of rational arguments on these issues and
the rights of the people
to petition the government for a redress of grievances
if they have a problem
with the way things are going. I hope that those of us
who truly care about
these and other rights make their voices heard loud
and clear before those
same rights are taken away from us by policies that
are bordering on Fascism.
If you don't like it when someone like me wants to try
to get a balanced view
of the issues by attmpting to obtain information from
sources outside of
their general sphere of resources, then I suggest you
stop reading any more
emails and simply rely on CBS news or wherever you go
to shop for your daily
dose of yellow journalism. Of course, you are more
than welcome to
participate in a Flame War with me, but it will be a
rather futile exercise
(you can't have a war with only one side fighting!),
so I would encourage you
to maintain your dignity and stop before you start.
With all due respect,
Artillo
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