From: Dickey, Michael F (michael_f_dickey@groton.pfizer.com)
Date: Thu Jan 23 2003 - 07:43:03 MST
-----Original Message-----
From: Samantha Atkins [mailto:samantha@objectent.com]
Dehede011@aol.com wrote:
> Samantha,
> I personally don't think your "feelings" are anything for us to
base
> national policy on. In the first place I can't take your feelings out of
> your head to even check that you are reporting them accurately. So I
treat
> them as just another rant.
"I gave no rant. I told you off for claiming I was just mouthing empty
slogans as if I had no real thought (several posts accused
all who think like I of this) or didn't really have any investment but was
just passing on something I presumably picked up by osmosis."
Such as your opinions on Vietnam?
"Once again you now bob and weave"
Pot calling the kettle black? You should hardly be one to accuse someone of
'bobbing and weaving' considering multilpe people on this list have
repeatedly asked you to justify your stance on Vietnam, especially when you
make clear statement about opposing murderous regimes (such as Hitler) in
WWII yet find the same attempt to oppose an even more murderous regime
'senseless' when considering Vietnam. I also asked you multiple times what
you felt of the Korean war, and to compare and contrast it with the Vietnam
war. Since I made a valient attempt to not come off as making personal
attacks or present my case in a condescending tone, I can only conclude that
you can not present the justification for your opinions on these matters and
thus choose to ignore them entirely. Or perhaps a small seed of doubt has
been planted in the back of your mind that those anti-war protests you took
part in actually contributed to the mass murder of millions of Indochinese
people. Perhaps you find this so disturbing that this is why you ignore
these comments and inquiries. Or perhaps I have allready made it into your
'kill file' Got to silence those dissenting opinions eh? Or maybe im just
a promoter of 'anti-communist propoganda'
"I am done with your massive intellectual dishonesty"
Intellectual dishonesty? I am still waiting to hear if you feel the korean
war was also 'senseless' and if it wasn't, why was it not senseless yet the
vietnam war was?
The latest estimates are that the state of North Korea has killed 2 million
people in the recent famine. This would make it the worst state killing
since Cambodia in the 1970s. It would push the total killing by the
communist regime since its origin to about 4 million people, making
communist North Korea the 6th greatest killer since 1900. Compare North
Korea with South Korea, which started with similiar popuations and have
nearly identical climates, land area, people, and culture. Yet South Korea,
which embraced capitalism and democracy at the end of the Korean War is now
the 11th largest economy in the world, a bustling hub of progress and growth
which recently hosted the Olympics. North Korea, on the other hand, embraced
massive statism, it is the only full fledged communist state intact, its
people are desperately poor and millions have starved to death, while
factories and fields remain unused and empty it receives billions in
international aide while maintaining a standing army of 1 million with
artillary constantly aimed at South Korea's capital. A truly sad state of
affiars.
Following is an excellent article by Reason Columnist Cathy Young on the
perception of communism in the west and in academic elites circles. She
criticizes the west for not acknolwedgeing the heinous crimes of communism
(amounting to about 150 - 170 million murders this century) becuase the west
spent a good amount of time in political favor with many of these communist
leaders. Rejecting communism also entails the acceptance that the US efforts
during the cold war in Vietnam, Korea, Afghanastan and other areas were
morally justified (albiet, as she notes, imperefectly handled) Given the
fact that more people died in the six months following the United States
removal from the Indochina region then in the entire conflict and
subsequently 1/3rd of the Cambodian population died from the corrupt,
communist, despotic, tyrannical regime which took over there, and that many
actions of US liberals and Academic elites directly supported and made these
events more likely to occur, its no wonder that those same people are
reluctant to admit that communism is as bad as Nazism.
See - http://www.reason.com/cy/cy082702.shtml "Still struggling with Stalin"
By Cathy Young
Young reviews Martin Amis' new book "Koba the Dread: Laughter and the Twenty
Million" in which the author chronicles Soviet crimes against humanity and
questions the double standard between Nazism and Communism.
Excerpt - "The left's reluctance to acknowledge that Communism wasn't just a
failure but an evil is due to more than stubbornness. Such an acknowledgment
would amount to (1) validating a view of the West, Communism's Cold War
adversary, as good (albeit imperfect), and (2) admitting that the left spent
much of the 20th century cozying up to mass murderers and therefore has
precious little moral authority to criticize the West today. And that's very
relevant to present-day global conflicts. "
"Welcome to my killfile."
On behalf of Samatha's kill file, MaxPLumm and I would like to welcome Ron H
as well. Perhaps Mr. Lorrey will be soon joining us...
Michael Dickey
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