Re:PEACE?: Gotta love those polls! (NOT really about IRAQ)

From: Aditya Tyagi (aditya_tyagi@yahoo.com)
Date: Wed Mar 12 2003 - 13:59:19 MST

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    *APPLAUSE TO ARTILLO*

    It's about time someone told Ron H. to his face like
    it is. Thank you very much, Artillo! I've not been on
    this group all that long, but I surmise there are far
    more lurkers than posters, with Ron H. definitely
    being one of the more frequent posters. After reading
    his posts for some time now, I'm convinced his
    knowledge of world history is pretty limited and he
    likes it to be that way. Everything has to be
    American-centric and if anyone disagrees, he's quick
    to label them "anti-American". He seems to be able to
    think in terms of only black and white without seeing
    the many shades of gray on various
    socio/political/economic/etc issues that are extremely
    complex. For a man of his experience, education, and
    age, it's sad that people can be so dumb in this day
    and age.

    Thanks again, Artillo.

    aditya

    Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 17:16:52 EST
    From: Artillo5@cs.com
    Subject: Re:PEACE?: Gotta love those polls! (NOT
    really about IRAQ)

    In a message dated 03/11/2003 2:17:16 PM Eastern
    Standard Time,
    Dehede011@aol.com writes:

    << In a message dated 3/11/2003 12:32:08 PM Central
    Standard Time,
     Artillo5@cs.com writes: What *I* want to see is an
    international poll to see
     what percentage of people in the world think that if
    the international
     community fails to act firmly now against the UNITED
    STATES, then the world
     will become a more dangerous place in years to come?
     
     Arti,
            None of that matters. What counts is that the
    US is the one that has
     been shot at, hit, lost citizenry/visitors, and is
    being aimed at again.
     That you wish to knock off the US, aren't concerned
    with American loss of
     life and don't like us anyway means nothing.
     Have a good day,
     Ron h.
    >>

    Ron,

    Up until now I have refrained from responding on any
    of your commentary thus
    far, but I think this one takes the cake and is
    deserving of a reply.Your
    obvious lack of reading comprehension skills and
    penchant for putting words
    in people's mouths makes you sound like more of a
    buffoon than ever before.

    Point #1: I think that the opinion of the world's
    human beings matters very
    much. Unfortunately, there will never be a completely
    honest representation
    of people's opinions in any poll for obvious reasons.

    Point #2: Nowhere in my post did I EVER state that I
    "wish[ed] to knock off
    the US" as you seem to think I did. I think I stated
    my intentions rather
    plainly in the original post. Read more carefully next
    time.

    Point #3: I am not only concerned with the loss of
    American lives, but the
    lives of EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING ON THE PLANET. If
    war can be averted at any
    cost then THAT is the road we need to take for
    HUMANITY'S sake. We need to
    stop slaughtering eachother over bullshit ideological,
    religious, or
    otherwise dogmatic reasons.

    Point #4: I think you have the misconception that I am
    not an American
    Citizen. The only kinds of people I dislike are
    ignorant, close-minded, and
    blindly patriotic, but... this is America and everyone
    is entitled to their
    opinion as long as it's not forced down our throats.
    Would I be better off as
    a citizen of another country? I surely don't know.

    Ron, why exactly are you still on this list? It seems
    to me that much of the
    rhetoric I have seen you spouting off recently seems
    to have very little with
    core Extropian values and a lot to do with you being
    pissed off at the way
    the world is today. YES I agree with you, the world is
    a pretty messed up
    place, YES there are lots and lots of bad people out
    there, and YES there are
    many forms of injustice out there, however, I do NOT
    agree with ANY
    government who decides to KILL to support their own
    brand of dogma, INCLUDING
    the United States. I also am very disconcerted about
    the direction the
    current US administration and it's agents are taking
    this country are taking
    in regards to our civil liberties. I don't think I
    have to lecture you on the
    importance of rational arguments on these issues and
    the rights of the people
    to petition the government for a redress of grievances
    if they have a problem
    with the way things are going. I hope that those of us
    who truly care about
    these and other rights make their voices heard loud
    and clear before those
    same rights are taken away from us by policies that
    are bordering on Fascism.

    If you don't like it when someone like me wants to try
    to get a balanced view
    of the issues by attmpting to obtain information from
    sources outside of
    their general sphere of resources, then I suggest you
    stop reading any more
    emails and simply rely on CBS news or wherever you go
    to shop for your daily
    dose of yellow journalism. Of course, you are more
    than welcome to
    participate in a Flame War with me, but it will be a
    rather futile exercise
    (you can't have a war with only one side fighting!),
    so I would encourage you
    to maintain your dignity and stop before you start.

    With all due respect,

    Artillo

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