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>Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 03:15:13 -0700
> Samantha Atkins <samantha@objectent.com> extropians@extropy.org Re: Tolerance strategies (was: Two Essays on the violence...)Reply-To: extropians@extropy.org
>
>Zero Powers wrote:
>>
>> >From: "Alex F. Bokov" <alexboko@umich.edu>
>>
>> >Okay, here is a rephrased an simplified version of my question:
>> >
>> >Given that intolerant and absolutist memes can by definition exist
>> >within a tolerant and relativist society, but not vice versa, what
>> >strategies can the tolerant and relativist society use to survive?
>> >Will these strategies require it to relinquish some of its tolerance
>> >and relativism?
>>
>> Here's an even simpler version of the trick question you are asking:
>>
>> Can a tolerant person/society not tolerate intolerance and still be
>> considered tolerant? I think the obvious answer is "yes."
>>
>> What strategies will it take? I think that's a simple one too. You simply
>> live and let live, until the intolerant person/society uses their liberty to
>> try to relieve you of yours. At that point you respond with something like,
>> oh say, operation "Enduring Freedom."
>]
>
>You must be joking. This "war" is not about freedom, enduring
>or otherwise. It is about vengeance, incredible hypocrisy and
>dishonesty about our own "terrorism" and grabbing more power in
>a region where we have been attempting to get rights to pipe oil
>across to growing Southeast Asian market for sometime. Our
>response has nothing to do with being tolerant or even remotely
>rational. At the current rate millions of Afghanis will die
>this winter from hunger. Do we honestly belief that is the
>result of our tolerance and fair action and that it is
>justified? If so then I submit that we have become so monstrous
>we do not even comprehend what we are any longer or what our
>ideals are or what we wish they are. We will have become only a
>self-justifying blind King of Tyrants.
>
If you believe that we would not be proceeding with this campaign in Yemen, the Sudan, Libya, Somalia, Iraq, Iran, Lebanon's Bekaa Valley or anywhere else that bin Ladin had been welcomed to hide after the WTC atrocity, regardless of possible economic benefits or the lack of same, you are more brainless than others on the list have decided that you are.
>>
>> I think our aim is to wipe out intolerance, but only by means that will not
>> unnecessarily agitate the intolerant. Think Chinese handcuffs again.
>>
>
>Millions more deaths damn well should agitate any caring
>people. Being kept in the dark by our own government and having
>our civil liberties auctioned off wholesale to the the very
>instrument of so much that is wrong in the world, the CIA,
>should agitate us. But we munch away happily on the McNews fed
>to us by media largely controlled by the same corporations that
>made our President and VP rich men and that have manipulate the
>region into its current mess over decades. But go on as you
>are. Go on wrapping the tattered rags of your
>self-righteousness about your threadbare true lack support for
>freedom, sovereignity, human rights and justice in much of the
>world. Enjoy your pretense but don't imagine for a second that
>your hatred for those who do not share this game of pretend is
>the just behavior of the "tolerant".
>
It appears that it is you whom are intolerant; intolerant odf justice for the 5000+ murdered on our own home soil, intolerant of the necessity of preventing future promised attacks from the same animals in the future, and intolerant of the necessity of demonstrating to other jihadic wannabees that we are not a weak and dying society, and that murderous attacks upon our civilian citizens carry dire and terminal consequences.
>
>- samantha
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