Re: Hyper-AI's vs Transhumans

Dan Clemmensen (
Sun, 03 May 1998 20:37:36 -0400

Paul Hughes wrote:
> Dan Clemmensen wrote:
> > I think you are making some unsupported assumptions:
> > -- you asusme that AIs are separate entities.
> > -- you assume that augmented humans are separate entities.
> > -- you assume a polarization between humans and AIs
> AhhhhHHHHHHh! Please *READ* my post as you obviously *didn't* the first
> time!
> You missed my entire my point which showed exactly that. I'll repeat it
> again:
> **There is NO meaningful difference between Hyper-AI's and Transhumans.**
> Now that I've made that clear, my conclusions regarding the argument of
> 'who grants rights to who' becomes moot.
> Paul.
> P.S. Why are so many people on this list so preoccupied with shredding
> peoples arguments that they don't even bother reading or trying to
> understand what other people are writing? If there is a loss of S/N on
> this list, it's due in large part to people putting their ego's and elitist
> bully attitudes first over genuine and healthy discussion and debate. Am I
> alone on this list in thinking this way?

Paul, I just re-read your post. I still feel that your post makes the
assumptions I mentioned above. You refer repeatedly to "transhumans"
and "AIs" in the plural, and you seem to describe a scenario in which
both types of entities exist until a synthesis occurs. I'm sorry if
you feel that I was attempting to shred your arguments. I'm not.
Let's see where we agree and where we have different perspectives.
Then, we can focus on the reasons for the difference in perspepective.

--First difference: I do not feel that I have an ego problem, or an
elitist bully attitude.
--Second differnce: I do not feel that comments referring to other
list members using terms like "ego", "elitist", and "bully" contributes
to the discourse.

--First major point of agreement: We both appear to believe that the
dichotomy between AI and transhuman will eventually become irrelevant.

--Third difference: You appear to believe that multiple AIs and transhumans
will appear and then coalesce. I feel that a single SI will appear and
grow by accretion of computing power.

Shall we continue refining our perspectives regarding this last point?
Alvernatively, if you care to point out other differences, we might
work on those, too.