Re: Our Friend Sasha (Cryonics &c.)

From: Steve (
Date: Sat May 13 2000 - 06:52:59 MDT

Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 18:26:08 -0500
From: "altamira" <>
Subject: RE: Our friend Sasha (was RE: success of cryonics arrangements)

>I had not thought to bring up the possibility of human consciousness apart
>from the body on this list, since most of the participants seem to see the
>mind and body as inseparable and to think of physical immortality as a
>prerequisite to mental immortality.

I think there is a 'reporting' problem here ....... mental immortality might
be (theoretically) possible for the subject, but without any physical
substrate noone else can have evidence of this continuance.

>However, since Sasha's death, there's
>been more talk of the possibility that consciousness can exist apart from a
>physical container for some length of time.

To understand where consciousness might be going, I have always thought it
wise to understand its origins, and specifically the shift from FINITE-STATE
E-2 brains to the modern INFINITE-STATE E-1 (minus pineal eye) systems such
as our own. Your term "physical container" has a bias in supposing that
consciousness is a 'separate' thing that is somehow 'contained' rather than
continuous with the physical.

>Earlier in this post I mentioned experiences I've had which lead me to
>believe that our minds are only fragments of a greater intelligence. One
>these experiences involves a sort of super-data-base which can be accessed
>from altered states of consciousness such as a trance state. I haven't
>studied enough psychology to know if this is the sort of thing Jung
>to as the "collective unconscious" but I've heard the term, and it seems to
>fit the experience.


Jung's psychotherapy works very well in practice with lots of people, and I
use his Shadow Self theory and techniques quite often with clients. I find
his collective unconscious idea more problematic, but it resonates with
certain people. MVT overcomes many of the issues that you are concerned

Steve Nichols
Official Journal of the Post-Human Age

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