RE: cancer rates (was: e: How do you calm down the hot-heads?)

From: matus (matus@matus1976.com)
Date: Fri Sep 12 2003 - 12:02:05 MDT

  • Next message: Robert J. Bradbury: "Re: cancer rates (was: e: How do you calm down the hot-heads?)"

    >-----Original Message-----
    >From: Robbie Lindauer
    >
    >> Incorrect, merely existing longer makes you more likely to
    >get cancer,
    >> regardless of pollutants or carcinogens or ionizing radiation.
    >
    >That would be assuming things like "breathing air" or "existing under
    >the sun" doesn't cause cancer.

    Its called entropy. Even if anti-oxidants destroyed every unbound
    electron pair in free radicals, even if all ionizing radiation is
    shielded, even if were are examing cells in a controlled petri dish in a
    perfect environment. Some of those cells will eventually become
    cancerous. This is because the cellular copying mechanisms are not
    perfect, and cancers are just cells with different genetic structures.

    >
    >The rest of your point I've already made.
    >
    >As for whether or not plants cause cancer - maybe they do, but that
    >wouldn't explain why it's a greater killer now than 200 years
    >ago. For
    >that you'd have to add in the social factors.
    >

    Look, no offense, but I don't think you know anything about cancer. I
    am no world renowned oncology expert, but cancer has been a subject of
    interest for me. Plants did not cause cause because for the last
    900,000 years people DIED before enough mutations built up to cause a
    cell to reproduce, undifferentiated, as quickly as possible, which is
    what cancer is. It takes *at least* five mutations for a cell to become
    cancerous, 50% of cancerous cells have a mutation in the p53 gene, if
    one of your parents gamete cells has that mutation, you are far more
    likely to get cancer throughout your lifetime then people without that
    mutation. Its not just any five mutations, but a whole score of
    mutations can occur in different places in the genome. But only some of
    those places of your genome, when changed, will make a cell cancerous.
    At least five of the target areas have to be mutation. Mutations can
    come from a variety of sources, free radicals, ionizing radiation,
    toxins, etc. etc. But there must be at least five. Any particular cell
    has a particular chance of getting a mutation throughout its life. The
    longer a cell lives, the more mutations it gets. When that cell
    replicates, its child cells inherient its mutations. Just as a child
    whose parents have one of the critical mutations has now every cell in
    his body with that mutation, all child cells of a mutated parent cells
    in any being also inherient all mutations. Eventually, all cells in
    your body (with the exception of nuerons) are child cells of parents,
    and more and more cells in your body get more and more mutations as you
    exist longer and longer. This is why age is so directly tied to
    increase in cancer cases. IF a child is born with four of the five
    required mutations *in every cell of his body* he will probably get
    cancer at a very young age, since only one cell in his entire body needs
    to have the correct area of his genome mutated.

    In short, it does explain it, you just don't understand it. I suggest
    you refrain from making assertive comments of areas where you do not
    have sufficient background knowledge to be that assertive.

    Michael Dickey



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