RE: GOV: US Reputation

From: Lee Corbin (lcorbin@tsoft.com)
Date: Tue Apr 15 2003 - 00:33:58 MDT

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    Keith writes

    > For some people to believe X is a threat, there must be
    > hard evidence, and theory is not enough. For some people
    > to believe that X may be a threat in the future, less
    > evidence is required, and a good theory may be enough.

    I did note that during the pre-war debate that a number
    of people (not on this list) allowed the meme "guilt
    beyond a reasonable doubt" to affect their judgment.

    One problem (!) with the people on this list is that
    they don't hang out enough in tough bars, where much
    more standard "rules" hold. We evolved in situations
    that put a lot of stress on intuition; our responses
    of anger, submission, and intimidation are innate, and
    not always fully comprehendible yet by our rational
    natures.

    > (Summing-up amidst charges of being academic...)
    > It will eventually fall to academics (which I am
    > not) to review the theories propounded as
    > rationales for pre-emption.

    What is scary about many real-world situations is that
    they might not yield to academic analysis.

    "Street Smarts" are something that very few of the gentle
    readers of the Extropian mail list can claim to have. It
    amounts to, so far as this equally innocent poster is aware,
    presenting a public aspect that intimidates or in other
    ways deters those who would take advantage of one. (Also
    is conveyed, of course, by the term, is wisdom that would
    guide you in avoiding unwanted confrontations and not
    presenting yourself as a target of opportunity.) So many
    of the world's civilized people, like you and me, have
    not ever understood what comes very easily to bullies
    and those who have to live near them. We more or less
    expect everyone to behave the way our neighbors do, and
    sadly, we then project our intuitive expectations into
    realms where they are not appropriate.

    There have been a number of lessons emerging from recent
    events, so far. (How many more will emerge is anyone's
    guess, as hardly needs to be said.) It now seems probable
    that there were

      * subtle internal forces in the West that naturally
         allied themselves with the horrors of Hussein's
         regime. Certain modes of thought, certain
         systematic misjudgments.

      * a serious lack of good intuition concerning the
         motivations and psychology of the Iraqis, and
         perhaps many other Arab countries as well (Where
         are all the terrorist reprisals that so many of
         us, not excluding me, were certain would occur
         when an invasion commenced?)

      * (and as Keith points out) a serious intuitive
         lack of understanding of the role and effects of
         threats and actions; perhaps even a similar
         misunderstandings of the realities of dominance
         and submission.

    The aspirations of many people around the world, and the
    understandable resentment that many have against the United
    States are very real, and are not without justification IMO.
    (More about this in another post.)

    The situation is so very much complicated by the acknowledgment
    that many of us have to feel that once again somehow the United
    States has been proved to have been right; whatever the shifting
    justifications for the war have been; whatever total package
    of motivations has been or is involved; whatever bad omens
    have arisen and worries the future exacerbated---the bottom line
    is that goals have been furthered that practically all of us on
    this list would endorse.

    Future historians might well wonder exactly what, following
    the end of the cold war, took the United States so long in
    getting rid of an enemy like the Baathists. It now appears
    that the Baath party is similar to the Nazi party in many
    ways, whereas we have been conceiving of Iraq as though
    Hussein had been a simple Latin American strongman. Should
    members of the Baath party be hunted down wherever they are?
    Future historians may think that even asking such a question
    to be symptomatic of the malaise and peculiar lack of
    confidence the West has in its own ideals.

    Lee



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