From: Lee Corbin (lcorbin@tsoft.com)
Date: Tue Feb 18 2003 - 01:02:51 MST
Lee Daniel Crocker wrote
> What's good about defending a country? I certainly don't give a damn
> about the US or any other country, and I have little patience for
> patriots of any stripe. How about standing up for /principles/
> instead of countries like a rational forward-looking person should?
> The old concept of "country" is one whose time is passed. Let's move
> into the future and support the rights of sovereign sentient beings.
The future won't be here for a while, and you surely understand
the evolutionary forces behind patriotism. Don't you agree that
countries whose citizens are endowed with patriotism survived
throughout history whereas countries not so endowed perished?
Yet you are not annoyed by the irrational love of a mother
for her child. Why are you annoyed, then, by the irrational
love of someone for his or her nation?
Now if you and I lived in a post-apocalyptic future and our
little commune's survival was at stake, I'll bet that your
instincts would rise to the occasion. In some extensions, you
might even be willing to sacrifice yourself for the community.
Or would you head for the hills as soon as you had a chance?
At times, I feel like a defector (in the game-theoretic sense)
when I don't feel much patriotism. I'm here and alive because
my ancestors and their neighbors in America and Europe felt
some community spirit, and would defend their tribe based
partly on their feelings.
> I agree that one must grant nations /practical/ import, the same way
> that one must recognize the physical power of the government you live
> under to jail you or worse.
And of course, your self-interest is clear here. I don't blame you
for your self-interest in the slightest, but simply am reminding
you that most people feel more than that at times, and you probably
do too.
> But the post to which I was replying seemed to imply
> that nations had some /moral/ import; he seemed to
> say that the protesters were "anti-American", as if
> there were something wrong with that.
Well, if I moved to China, there *would* be something
wrong with me being "anti-China". At the very least,
it would be immense ingratitude to my neighbors. As
for souls in other countries being "anti-U.S.", most
of them deny it. As for those who don't deny it, I
praise their candor, but have to also consider them
enemies of the folks currently giving me sustenance
and protection. That makes them my enemies.
Lee Corbin
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