Re: sex, yet again ~%6 (was Re: ; - )Neanderthal Miracles)
Tue, 5 Nov 1996 12:17:03 -0500


[Eugene: upload sex is obsolete.]
>I don't think the uploads will be able to afford conventional (simulated
flesh) sex much longer. If we assume resources to be limited (unless
computation can be detached from the material carrier and we start
engineering our designer universes)>

First of all, who here, assumes that sex, or
uploaded simulation of, requires a flesh simulation?
We can understand that "mind" itself can experience
orgasm, in a 'wet dream' why must the uploads be
in flesh form to trade the impulses, electro
chemical or neuro connected (glandular) versions
of the pleasant, visual "fireworks " of orgasm or
pleasureable contact? In this case I wonder if you
are missing the point entirely of being "uploaded".
The idea of uploading assumes computational
abilities which can carry an intelligence, a human
personality which we can *recognize as us* into an
environment. If we do want to retain some human
elements, it may be neccessary to emulate some
hormonal action- remember this thread started with
Rich, who seems to think men are pretty much
hormone driven creatures; - )
How much bandwidth to simulate the impulses of the hypothalamus? In our
current "WETWARE", it takes up
only about one three hundredth of the brain.

>>>_and_ we admit Darwinian evolution in
(it will be impossible to keep him out, I'm afraid -- notice that this
automagically introduces some form of death, or do we speak Lamarckian
evolution here, where mutation leaves the organism altered, but alive-o?),

I'm afraid Lamarckian evolution finally may
have it's day in any conscious software that can
reprogram itself at will.

>we'll wind up having scarce resources, more sooner than later. Some of them
being time (attention devoted, etc), computation, whatever.

Not enough bandwidth for VR? I notice there is no talk
here of what TYPE of upload, dry, semi-soft, wet...
In neural activity, things move rather quickly, and
upload time will be at least as fast, a healthy sexual encounter may be
considered leasurely and lengthy
if it takes a second....

>>>Burning computational resources for body dynamics, fakespace renderers,
etc. might become too costly, once entire system matter has been
converted into a Dyson shell computer
(very soon, <<1 kYr), and this
mind substrate dish populated sufficiently densely (much faster, <<1 Yr).

You know this to be the only future? How so?
Even Moravec doesn't put too much faith in this..
I think he called Dyson's ideas "new and half baked..."
these are lovely ideas, but hardly concrete.
but even if it is so certain in your mind...

... why this attachment to replication and body? dont you enjoy a good