Re: Politics, Extropians

From: Randall Randall (
Date: Mon Dec 31 2001 - 17:33:02 MST

On Monday 31 December 2001 18:59, Natasha Vita-More wrote:
> At 05:50 PM 12/31/01 -0400, Randall Randall wrote:
> (Why did you change the subject line?)

Because I had nothing to say about US immigration or open borders,
at least in that email. :)

> > > [Cryofan] wrote:
> > > >>Since the Extropian movement is heavily invested in libertarian
> > > >>philosophy,
> > >
> > > Faulty conjecture and bad memetic engineering. If some extropians are
> > > Libertarian and others Republicans, some Democrats, some are
> > > a-political, and still others non-party line thinkers, the
> > > above-statement is an untenable generalization.
> >
> >Back when I first heard about extropians, one of the major attractions for
> >me was the combination of transhumanism and libertarianism. In fact,
> >that's how I thought of extropians -- as libertarian transhumanists.
> Why?

Because I am unaware of any other defining trait of extropians, as distinct
from all transhumanists.

> Just because some extropians are libertarian would you think that it
> was a personality trait of all extropians?

Actually, I don't think of libertarianism as a personality trait at all. I
think of it as a worldview, preferably one that has been chosen because
of its consistency and reflection of reality (or how reality seems to the
libertarian, anyway).

> >I'm not sure what distinguishes extropy from plain transhumanism, if not
> >advocacy of non-statism. Can someone help me out here?
> Good question. Actually, basically nothing other than a word
> "Extropy". Now, if we begin to unravel some of the history of how
> transhumanism got stated you would learn that there were Upwinger
> Transhumanists, Transhumanist Artists and other smaller groups of futurists
> who felt aligned with the transhumanist futurism. But, really, the word
> and ideas were first generated in the extropian community. The word
> transhumanism came out of the extropian philosophy. Not the other way
> around. However, FM-2030, wrote his view of what a transhuman is and I
> think that his "ideology" was significantly transhumanist.

I'm guessing you mean to say, "significantly extropian", as that would neatly
wrap this up. If not, I don't understand what you do mean.

> There was no
> political spin on transhumanism other than FM's views ideological
> globalism.
> >In any case, cryofan didn't mention any parties, and in fact used
> His inference was pretty darn strong.

It didn't seem so to me. Perhaps he'll correct me.

> >By the way, I imagine that "a-political" could easily be used to describe
> >libertarianism. :)
> Sure. I guess so. Frankly, I think political parties are old world.

We agree on this, at least.

Randall Randall <>
Crypto key:
On a visible but distant shore, a new image of man;
The shape of his own future, now in his own hands.-- Johnny Clegg.

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