Re: This funny Rosswel bussines

Mark Grant (
Thu, 17 Jul 1997 11:37:52 +0100 (BST)

> But I still don't like the
> inconsistencies that debunkers continue to ignore, and rely on gov't
> assertions contrary to truth, and evidence of records tampering and
> descruction.

Personally I don't like the way that believers ignore the very plain fact
that all contemporary accounts match that of a Mogul balloon and these
accounts weren't challenged until a third of a century later. Or do you
really believe that alien spacecraft are held together with scotch tape?

> Nope, it was a report by a soldier who claimed to be at the crash site
> of the full vehicle, not the Brazel ranch.

Again, if the saucer didn't exist then such reports don't matter. I mean,
I could claim to have been at the crash site and been temporally
distorted to the 1990s, but it wouldn't make it true.

> If its all cultural related to current scifi literature projections of
> technology, where are the cyber abductions? Where are the "I was
> uploaded by an alien" stories?

How often do you see those on Star Trek? They haven't yet filtered down
into popular culture.

> The reports I've seen said that the materials, when looked at under a
> microscope, looked like they were made up of bazillions of microscopic
> welds.
> This would necessitate a welding machine the size of bacteria, eh?

Possibly, but why should anyone believe the reports? And why would anyone
with the ability to build such a machine bother with 'welding'? Why not
just stick it together atom by atom to produce a perfect surface?

> Corso was at the base at the time. This is known.

Interesting; evidence?

> You forget the bureaucratic machine. Don't have something on base?
> where's the right contractor? From what I've seen of Area 51, its all
> contractor run. From my own experience on many bases, most of the
> logisitics stuff is handled by civilians and contractors.

And you think that such an organisation could keep this 'crashed alien
spacecraft' a secret for thirty-three years? Why is ignoring these
inconsistencies bad for 'debunkers', but fine for believers?

Anyway, if this mortician is the same one mentioned at
then his testimony is extremely suspect. That guy supposedly stated that
he visited the base with a nurse, and gave her name. That nurse isn't
mentioned in any contemporary records. When told this, our first-hand
witness admitted that yes, actually that wasn't her real name, and he
wouldn't give that out. Yeah, right. See the kind of people believers rely
on for their stories?

> The photos released were several days later, after Gen Ramey had put the
> cover story in place. Considering that weather balloons were heavily
> used by the weather people on base, gussying up something in a day or so
> would be rather easy.

So. You have evidence that anything was substituted? *Marcel says that the
photo is genuine*. You disbelieve your prime witness?

> According to Brazel, the eve before he initially found the scattered
> peices (June 15th), he and his family experienced a huge explosive
> sound, louder in his opinion than the lightning that was common on
> summer evenings in that area.

Hmm, do you have a source for this?

> But the mogul project was BASED at Roswell. If anyone knew what a Mogul
> balloon was, it would have been the people at Roswell field.

Alamogordo. Sorry.

> Anyways, outside of the radio reciever, the mogul balloon was exactly
> like a normal weather balloon. The radar reflectors were for radar
> tracking of the balloon.

Well, according to the Sceptical Enquirer:

"While many UFO proponents claim the wreckage shown in General Ramey's
office was just a weather balloon switched for the "real debris," Moore
pointed out that the radar targets used by NYU were unlike anything flown
in New Mexico before and that "they were not available in Fort Worth to be
substituted for the debris in General Ramey's office." Warrant Officer
Newton was able to recognize the debris in General Ramey's office because
he happened to have used an early version of the same targets while
serving as a weatherman in Okinawa. The earlier-model targets Newton used
did not have the reinforcing tape with the pinkish-purple flower designs."

But I guess Moore (one of the Project Mogul scientists) is just part of the
government coverup, right?

> According to the story, the larger wreckage was found several days or
> weeks later, once the story was clamped on.

Again, a story which didn't appear until over a third of a century later.
No-one has so far managed to produce any published account of a crashed
alien spacecraft at Roswell prior to "The Roswell Incident", which itself
only included second-hand accounts.