RE: Liberty vs. Extropy

O'Regan, Emlyn (
Wed, 26 May 1999 14:55:13 +1000

You should see the Australian film "Ghosts of the civil dead". Made in the '80s I think. Not for the faint hearted, almost on topic...

Rumumbah thar's paypal in thum thar preesons...


>From: den Otter[]
>Reply To:
>Sent: Tuesday, 25 May 1999 8:30
>Subject: Re: Liberty vs. Extropy
>> From: Michael S. Lorrey <>
>> > Apart from that, your
>> > prison system (and in fact just about all the prison systems of the
>> > so-called "civilized" nations) are simply barbaric. Little better than
>> > concentration camps, really.
>>> Well, we tried going the route that european prisons are: pretty much
>vocational education and psych treatment. Problem was, the recidivism stats
>that it was a failure here. Here, the stats seem to bear out that if you make
>life as unbearable as possible, a crook is far less likely to want to go back
>such an institution, so they took out the weight lifting equipment (reduces
>costs, esp. medical bills) they are taking out the college courses, etc.
>except at
>the minimum security resorts.<<
>My basic objection against the current (Euro & US) prison systems is that:
>1) They allow physical contact between inmates, which opens the
>door for rape, beatings, murder and other nastiness. Ironically, the
>worst, most hardened & violent criminals have the easiest time, while
>the lesser offenders suffer under their regime.
>2) The prison officials have way too much power, which results in
>situations as described above. In other words, the prison system
>is, just like the rest of the legal system btw, pretty much arbitrary.
>The solution: automated prisons (afaik, Greg Burch had a great
>post about this once). One inmate per cell, no physical contact
>between inmates and only highly monitored contact between
>guards and inmates. For good measure, every square inch of the
>prison should have camera surveillance, with direct and well-protected
>links to independent controlling organizations, at least some of which
>should be private (non-government), lawyers and maybe even the
>prisoner's relatives. All recorded data should be stored for at least
>one year, to serve as evidence in the rare case of some mishap
>(example: was a suicide *really* a suicide?).
>Educational programs, psychiatric/medical treatments should
>be optional, but simply keeping the offender out of the general
>population (in the case of murderers, by means of capital
>punishment) is good enough as far as I'm concerned.