Anti-Holism Flops... again!

Ian Goddard (
Sat, 21 Mar 1998 17:35:05 -0500

Anton Sherwood ( wrote:

>> We can relate two things that are
>> similar only to the extent that they are different,
>> for example that they occupy two different spaces.
>Or different times. If a cat walks into my room tonight, I will assume
>it's the same cat I saw this morning (unless its coloring is visibly
>different). I mentally relate (compare) two perceptions and judge them
>to be of the same entity; this is vernacular identity. I can never be
>certain that the cat hasn't been replaced with a similar cat while I
>wasn't looking, but as an operationalist I generally rely on the
>assumption that if I can't perceive a difference I can safely assume
>it's the same cat.

IAN: Silly argument. The relation is meaningful
only because the relation exists between two
DIFFERENT times. You just tried to find an
example of meaningful self-relation and did
so only by including exactly that which you
purported need not be a part of relation!
Also, the cat is always relatied to not-cat.

>If I were in a black void and the only thing illuminated were
>a cat, I would say, without looking about for another comparand,
>"That's Fluffy" (or not, as the case may be).

IAN: Fluffy is being related to the black void!
Fluffy is DIFFERENT than the black void. How more
obvious could it be? How more transparent can the
infection by the "same as" crackpot meme be? It's
causing you to make the most absurd arguments,
arguments that defeat themselves by 100%!

>And then there's binocular vision: two perceptions of the same thing at
>the same place and time, yet slightly different.

IAN: "Slightly different" is still different.
Good grief. All your cases against holistic
identity are actually cases for it!

Still wafting for an example of
a nonholistic identity.

>> The perfect "same as relation" would be a relation of a
>> thing to itself, but such a relation is a null relation.
>> Therefore the prevailing atomist definition of identity
>> is false, irrational, an clearly contrary to reality.
>And yet everyone but you finds a use for it.

IAN: No they don't. They don't know what
they're doing... confused as you are.
"Same as" simply defines the "=" symbol.
Is that useful? Yes; but it does not
tell us what identity actually is.

>> Identity is difference, and difference is holistic.
>War is peace.

IAN: If we did not know about good,
we would not know about bad.

VISIT Ian Williams Goddard ---->