Re: Tale of Two Economies

Arjen Kamphuis (
Tue, 17 Mar 1998 20:50:16 +0100 (CET)

Mike Lorrey wrote:
>Or busting down the door to the bar where two drunken bullies are
>pummeling each other, breaking them up, and making them go sit in
>the corner.

Of course the US did this mostly out of self-interest but at least they did
something, which is more than can be said for the European governements. In
the role of butt-kicking policeman they are still needed to cleanup messes
like Bosnia that European politicians, to their great shame, allowed to
exist for several years on in their backyard.

At this point in History the US is the only nation in the world that
combines sufficient military power and the kind of centralisation required
to be able to react to a thing like Bosnia or the Gulf. Europe could of
course, technically speaking, but lacks organisation and guts (mostly the

This irritates the hell out of me.

//snipped// some remarks about the functioning of US political system

(ROTFL slightly wondering who _He_ is banging this week :-)

>In a century where europeans and asians heralded the end of the age of
>the individual, and the advent of the collective,

You won't find religious fanatics blocking woman's clinics in europe, it is
only in the US that groups of people are allowed to try to violate such
individual rights.

>We have successfully purged the welfare state from our
>federal system, and most of our state governments.

Did you know that the US is one of the few 1st world countries in the world
were parkinson's disease is significantly lower among blacks and other
minority groups? Regrettably this is not because blacks in the US don't get
parkinson, it is because often they don't get treated and thus do not show
up in the statistics. Quite a feat for the most powerful mation in the
world today.

>Other nations that have followed suit now enjoy stronger economies
>than their stagnant socialist neighbors.

We have been over this before but maybe it did not register or something,
the above sentence is abosulute and total B.S. (tough but that's what it is).
European countries with the most extensive welfare systems like Germany and
the Netherlands are the strongest economies on the continent. And our
currency is a hell of a lot more stable than the US $.

Instead of believing that a welfaresystem necessarily leads to economic
collapse or something why don't you prove it? And don't just use France or
some former East-block nations as an example. The fact that a welfare
system is impossible to implement in the US without all kinds of bad
side-effects only tells us something about US-society. The _fact_ that
there are countries in this world that have the combination of a very
healty economy and a extensive welfare system shows that it is possible,
given competent leadership, organisation and a sense mutual responsibility.

There are more ways to Rome and we happen to like this one.

The point is that the US has been good at technical innovation and
containment of aggressors. But that does not mean that US policy makers
can't learn from other countries. US drug policy is still very stupid and
outdated and _many_ US citizens are suffering because of this. Instead of
just saying that America is doing so great maybe it would be smart to
listen to others and learn from their succes stories.


(will I ever learn to stay out of these discussions? will I ever grow up? I
fear not, c'est la condition humaine or something ;-)

Arjen Kamphuis | "Here Be Dragons", read the ancient maps | in all the white spots that seemed large
enough to hold the fabled creatures.

let's go dragon hunting.

Transcedo, the Dutch Transhumanist site: