Re: Suggestion: Extropian Country

den Otter (
Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:41:44 +0100

> From: Technotranscendence <> wrote:
> At 02:01 PM 2/16/98, Prof. Gomes <> wrote:
> >We could think in stablishing an extropian country...
> >
> >We'll need, among other things:
> >
> >1. some extropian billionaires to initial finnancial support.
> That makes it easy! (I'm being ironic for those who don't know.:)
You don't need billionaires to buy your own island state. I've seen
a relatively recent documentary about a bunch of English folks
who wanted to do just this, and they could buy a relatively big island
off the coast of Panama or so for about 30.000.000 (I think dollars).
The required financial imput per perseon/family would have to be about
a million, considering the size of the group. This is certainly feasible
for middle class folks who sell their house etc. Although this particular
attempt resulted in nothing (the moral high-horse "leader" of the group,
that wanted an island "free of criminals, drugs, child molesters etc."
turned out to be a child molester himself, but by then the project had
already failed because it lacked good organization, and the island that
was to be bought turned out to be a dumpsite for US chemical weapons)
there were some interesting things:
--several countries were very eager to sell one (or more) of their islands to
an autonomous group, they really don't care about your beliefs as long as
you bring money
--buying an island is not only for the super rich, a relatively small group
of normal-income folks can do it. Apart from this, you could set up a
special project to finance things (and don't use borrowed money --
it's always trouble).

> >2. chose a small site in, f.ex., Africa, which we could buy... ( They need
> >money and we need a place...).
Africa is a bit politically unstable and has some very nasty diseases etc.
One of the islands of the Seychelles on the other hand :-) ...

> I don't like crowds. Imagine lots of protechs in one place and a neoLuddite
> with a large bomb...
Of course you keep a low profile, and have some defences. Nobody's going
to drop bombs on an obscure island with a couple of hundred technofreaks/
immortailsts, unless you give them a very good reason. Besides, I don't
think that the majority of transhumanists would want to move to this place
permanently. Most would just come over for visits (to have some uninhibited
fun & networking) or to die (hassle-free cryo suspensions etc.) Bombing the
island would _not_ wipe out the transhuman community, and I don't think
the luddite scumballs would even bother to get bombs and go all the way
to this resort-like place to blow it up (you need a *lot* of explosives and
good co-ordination for something like this. It's not like posting a mail bomb).

> But seriously, we might exhaust valuable effort in trying to attain such a
> state. Much better/cheaper to focus on recruiting new people to our
> ranks AND developing better tech/science/philosophy/art in the
> interim. Don't (all of) you agree?
One idea doesn't exclude another. I think we could use a place with a
all-out extropic culture. It's fun (do anything as long as you don't harm others
against their will) and very practical (place for "controversial" research,
cryonics, safe haven in case of global war/other disaster etc.) Spreading
the risks...

Michael Lorrey <> wrote:
> Y'know, I've been wondering why those Project Aquarius and Millenial Project
> people are not getting anywhere. Duh, they could easily be buying up some of
> the hundreds of surplus oil tankers sitting in ports around the world to start
> their independent communities. Oil tankers are at least 1000 feet long, the
> size of a Nimitz class aircraft carrier, which houses a crew of 5000. With no
> airport to support, an oil tanker based community could easily support that
> many in much more spacious accomodations. link several together into a large
> raft or catamaran or trimaran and you're talking real space. Using those empty
> holds for starting workroom and you could get really grand. Olympic swimming
> pools, huge dance halls, and indoor rain forests/arboretums.
> Buy a couple Russian submarine nuclear propulsion systems for the ships and
> you're golden. I don't know if I'd trust such a large investment only to wind
> power.....If they only wanted to anchor the boats, they could easily generate
> all of their power needs from wave generation.
Great idea! How much does such an oil tanker cost? You could also buy a
relatively worthless island (no vegetation etc.) and permanently anker your
ship(s) alongside it, and connect everything. You'd have a homeland that's
at least partially unsinkable ;) My personal favourite would be a high luxury
cruiseship the size of the biggest supertanker...kind of like that Freedom Ship
City thing, only smarter designed.