Re: Star wars

Eugene Leitl (
Mon, 31 Mar 1997 04:41:22 +0200 (MET DST)

On Sun, 30 Mar 1997, Sean Morgan wrote:

> Guru George <> wrote:
> >Since I believe that only societies that discover capitalism will be
> >able to develop the requisite technology, I doubt that we will find many
> >star-roving socialist/fascist collectives - the only ones we do find
> >will be ones that stole the technology from the capitalist ones, just
> >like here on earth.
> GG, your email address is in the UK, so it is odd that you need reminding
> that it was fascists who made the big advances in rocketry in the middle of
> this century.

You forget the Ziolkovsky/GIRD/Katjusha/Andrjusha product line, which,
while certainly less spectacular, and distinctly more low-tech than
Vergeltungswaffen (propantrioltrinitrate-gellied nitrocellulose rather than
ethanol/LOX), were great for target saturation, both psycho &
physiological target. First crude "fire arrow" rocketry has been
invented in China, and used in India against the British occupation,
albeit in minor skirmishes, and to little effect.

Interestingly enough, the most efficacious weapons, whether ICBMs, or
bazooka-like fired recoilles antitank/fighter rocketry, are all
intelligently guided actio=reactio rockets nowadays. While skull guns and
cookie cutters is bullshit, g-amounts of lead azide detonating within the
body makes great hydrostatic shockwaves, which trigger all affected neurons
simultaneously, the next thing after the high-velocity cartridgeless
ammo gun. Of course Vernor "Mr. Future" Vinge knew it right from the start.

> Also, the Nazis were capitalists (despite the name 'National Socialists').
> They didn't steal technology from capitalist, they *were* capitalists -- and
> they developed a lot of it themselves.

They were not. Nazis were a grand-scale planned economy, Schickelgruber &
consorts would have gone broke, if they hadn't started a JIT war.
Assimilation of Swedish iron ore, and Romania's oil fields were
choreographed right from the start. However, Adolf fell prey to Bill's
assumption of being a generalist. While Bill backed out just in time,
Adolf was demented enough to enforce it right to the showdown. According
to Solshenytzin's "V kruge pervom" (dunno whether this is pure fiction,
or actually authentic information), Voshd Narodov Dshugashvili (terminal
syphilis and massive paranoia both kinda make a pattern), planned a
counterstrike. Good things psychotics of any colour, whether "keine
j"udische Physik", or "ich will keinen Kinntop im Kockpit" have been
notoriously wary of technology.

Let's hope their successors won't notice a pattern, and act constructively.

> The collectivist aspect of the United States has a much better developed
> space program than any private industry initiative.

Yet. I think soon dramatically falling LEO launch costs (and privately
funded LEO-autoassembling autoreplicator missions to Luna may desert the
barren realm of scifi) will cause a flurry of activity in low earth orbit
missions, which will render NASA uncapable of action, since entirely broke.


> Your future is optimistic, but not based on historical fact.
> -------------------------------+---------------------------------------------
> Sean Morgan ( | "The chances of anything coming from Mars
> | are a million to one," he said.
> | "The chances of anything coming from Mars
> | are a million to one--but still they come!"

| |transhumanism >H, cryonics, |
| |nanotechnology, etc. etc. |
| |"deus ex machina, v.0.0.alpha" |
|icbmto:N 48 10'07'' E 011 33'53'' | |