Re: Giving up what you are for what you may become? (was: hole in a box)

From: Samantha Atkins (
Date: Mon Feb 18 2002 - 23:45:04 MST

Amara Graps wrote:

> Robert Bradbury:
>>Since matter = energy and energy is required for thought it would
>>seem that one is caught between a rock and a hard place in terms
>>of what one can be -- who one was or who one is -- but not both.
> why not both?

Indeed. Since one is a set of self-perpetuating patterns that
include some changes it seems that being both is inescapable.
Perhaps it is only when we try to slice ourselves into isolated
segments rather than being and becoming that their seems to be
an issue.

>>It seems inevitable that we must consume our memories
>>in order to survive. Not a pretty picture. It perhaps
>>gives new meaning to a perspective I've always been fond
>>of -- you must give up everything you are for what you
>>may become. Is what we may become sufficient?

Since you are in part a variety of possible becomings which
timewise gradually become you and what you were, it doesn't seem
like you give up everything you are. But you do have to let go
of your perhaps somewhat frozen notion of what "you are" in
order to become something significantly different with acceptance.

> Now we're treading in the area of philosophical-psychological-
> cultural-political social issues that I find most important
> to the survival of humans (into whatever form we evolve),
> but we have already heard the old adages from our parents and
> grandparents. I take these adages very seriously (consumes
> some part of my off hours).
> "Those who forget the lessons of the past are bound to repeat them ..."

Yes. But those who think the present is sufficiently like the
past to have old solutions work are often mistaken.

> "If we are ignorant of our roots, then humans will be dead meat puppets ..."

What are our roots? Are they all in the past or do we
continuously pick up our roots and put them down elsewhere and
grow new ones in the process? I don't think we will survive
long as uploads or posthumans if we cling to tenaciously to
roots that no longer all or even much of what we are nourished
by or growing from.

        - samantha

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