It has been a while since I have read "Brave New World" but I
had the impression that the Alpha's and Betas were engineered
for thier positions as much as the Gamma',Delta's and
epsilons.
--- "Michael S. Lorrey" <mlorrey@datamann.com> wrote:
> Charlie Stross wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 15, 2001 at 10:45:22AM -0500, Michael S.
> Lorrey wrote:
> > >
> > > The authors were writing about specifically different
> problems. Orwell
> > > was certainly warning about the problems of socialist
> tyranny,
> > > propaganda, and mind control, while Huxley was warning
> about the tyranny
> > > imposed by the stratification of a consumerist society
> along the lines
> > > of Classist Britain, totally ignoring the potential for
> automation
> > > eliminating the need for there to be Beta, Delta, Gamma
> or Epsiolon
> > > classes.
> >
> > On the contrary: he was acutely aware of it. Why do you
> think they kept
> > the gammas and epsilons?
> >
> > If automation eliminates the need for 90% of workers[*],
> then a utilitarian
> > critic of society will ask "what use are the unemployed
> 90%?"
> >
> > And from that question, it's a short step to advocating
> eugenic solutions
> > like, er, sterilization or [insert fave policies of the
> guy with the
> > moustache].
> >
> > -- Charlie
> >
> > [*] Note that this isn't the same as eliminating the need
> for 90% of the
> > work -- workers can be redeployed and retrained, most
> of the time. The
> > question is, what do you do when 90% of your
> population _can't_ be
> > retrained to do something useful?
>
> However, under the pretext of the novel, all non-Alphas
> were as they
> were *by design*. Since automation eliminates the need for
> lower classes
> to be made, then there is no need to intentionally produce
> lower class
> individuals within the context of the society of the novel.
> This
> presupposes that the society of the novel, because all
> people are the
> way they are by design, that all people could theoretically
> be born
> Alphas if left untampered. This theoretical concept of a
> fully alpha'd
> society supported completely by an automated society of
> robots was
> posited in the end but untested (what had been tested was
> the idea of
> Alphas filling every position in society, including
> drudgework
> positions). Huxley could not extrapolate this accurately
> because such a
> society has never occured before.
>
> While your 'short step' is something a luddite would accuse
> an extropian
> of, we'd rather advocate that everyone receive genetic
> therapy in the
> womb to maximize all potentials (as well as mandate that
> those that
> choose to use their bodies as person manufacturing
> facilities behave in
> compliance with OSHA regulations: i.e. no smoking, exposure
> to smoke or
> other toxic substances like alchohol, drugs, etc.) I'm for
> maximizing
> liberty, including that of the occupant of that person
> manufacturing
> facility. Optimally its rights should not be any less
> important than the
> mothers.
=====
"Beware he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he deems himself your master...Sid MeierIf anyone should still be left unconvinced on the benefits of pursuing these vices, let us remember these sage words of Abraham Lincoln: "It has been my experience that those with no vices have very few virtues."When we turn away from the darkness ofour past to take comfort in our peaceful lives, wesometimes forget how dearly that peace was bought. Butthere is much worth remembering in the darkness..."--Tolkein
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