Re: Optimism [Was: flame wars]

From: Bryan Moss (bryan.moss@dsl.pipex.com)
Date: Mon Jul 21 2003 - 08:45:44 MDT

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    Brett Paatsch wrote:

    > What do you take to be the Yudkowskian Singularity? I am curious if it
    > would overlaps with Eliezer's view of the Singularity.

    That's just the term I like to use for the standard Vingean, accelerating
    superintelligence scenario.

    > [...] It seems to me that the biological revolution will ensure that
    > people will "not stop caring" about computing in the near future.

    I should distinguish the general idea of computation, that will be widely
    applied, from the "cultural artifact" of the computer, be it the mainframe,
    personal computer, supercomputer. It's the latter that I think has had its
    day. For example, computers may play some role in neuroprosthesis, but the
    idea of a brain-machine interface beyond a prosthetic role or beyond a
    simple interface (i.e., "mind control" of existing interfaces), is unlikely.

    > Are you suggesting Artificial Intelligence is impossible?

    No, I'm suggesting that the philosophical argument, the question of whether
    computers are capable of genuine thought, is no basis for a research
    programme. (To be honest, I don't think it's even really interesting as
    philosophy.) If you want to create a brain, study the brain. The idea that
    we can simply sit down and program "thought" is absurd.

    > [...]
    > There may be *no* effective political place to draw the line for *any*
    > organisation that starts with the priority of confronting individual
    > mortality first, unless that organisation decides to pursue its goal
    > deliberately leaving some part of the human species outside its
    > considerations.

    This is a difficult issue. My partial solution is to argue that death, as
    an event, is culturally determined, and to ask that our view be given as
    much consideration as the "death is inevitable/desirable" view, under the
    auspice of the prevailing pluralism in society. Avoiding senescence would
    be a choice and a choice that casts itself as somewhat arbitrary, rather
    than a goal we apply to all humanity (the "millions of lives will be lost
    unless we cure aging" mentality). This requires two things: (1) greater
    understanding of what I just described as the "death is
    inevitable/desirable" view; and (2) a more detailed account of our own
    position and how it relates to the prevailing cultural situation. The
    tricky part is how to inaugerate our "sub-culture" without appearing
    arrogant; jettisoning the (mock) horror and confusion we feel at the idea
    that some people want to die is only the start. My own hope is that the
    tension between wanting to get the word out, to secure funding, etc, and
    wanting a morally defensible exclusionary practise (so we don't just seem
    like a bunch of arrogant Westerners who want to live forever while half the
    world is starving) will be alleviated simply by elucidating our position.
    My feeling is that our goals here aren't a simple product of hubris.

    > [...]
    > The telephone is inanimate.

    A book is inanimate. Yet it embodies the ideology of its author, its time,
    its culture. Of course, the book is a particular kind of artifact designed
    to communicate, but I doubt anyone now thinks a book communicates only that
    which it was specifically designed to communicate. It's a reasonable
    extension to suggest a technology, designed with a particular function in
    mind, brings with it certain other "functions" reflective of the time and
    place of its inception. Usually these cultural biases are ascribed, in
    technology, through certain notions of efficiency and optimality. When a
    technology is transplanted from one culture to another, the result is far
    more complicated than a simple "progress." (We can accept this while
    rejecting the stronger thesis that there is no such thing as progress.)

    BM



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