Re: spiritual hyperspace

From: Dana Hedberg (
Date: Mon Jul 17 2000 - 15:18:15 MDT

altamira wrote:
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:
> > []On Behalf Of Dana Hedberg
> > Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 4:19 PM
> > Would you consider the environment/surroundings as an 'entity'?
> No.
Ah. Well, I thought I would ask, because if you were a believer in Gaea
Theory, then your use of the word spiritual to mean a 'connection' with
that entity, I would capitulate and agree your usage is appropriate.

> Perhaps
> > you could elaborate on your use of connection?
> Maybe it would be better to say a cause and effect link rather than a
> connection. I need to think about this a while, and I'll try to remember to
> come back to this question again if I come up with a better answer.
Cause and effect link? Hmmm. I'm trying to see what you mean by this
given the example you posted a while back. When you released the coyote,
that was the cause which generated the effect of being able to commune
with it?

> I'm perfectly willing to
> > accept an explanation that simply involves an ineffable feeling that
> > there is something binding you and the perceived.
> I'm not.
Interesting. Why not? However, let me clarify this statement a bit. I'm
willing, in general, to accept others' "I just have this feeling. I
can't describe it, but there is definitely something there.". I may
question to explore further, but there seems little point in getting
someone to describe something that they have just said they can not.
This doesn't mean that the issue can not be revisited, but I'm for
moving on when current avenues appear to be failing.

> > I don't think anyone was denying the phenomena exist. At least for me, I
> > was questioning the appropriate usage of the word when it seems others
> > are available that do a better job at representing what you are
> > experiencing.
> I now agree with you that "spiritual" is not a good word to use.
> Unfortunately, I'm not sure what to use in its place to describe that aspect
> of consciousness which is not included in the generally aceepted scientific
> definition. What other words would you use?
Well, it's kind of funny you ask that. I would most likely use the word
'numinous' or 'commune'. It's funny because one of the definitions for
numinous is holy; the same connotation I wish to avoid with spiritual.
However, I might argue that usage of the word numinous is uncommon
enough that religious baggage is no longer attached (i.e., forgotten or
just not known). Also, one of the definitions is an appeal to higher
emotions or an aesthetic sense, which definitely gets across the feeling
I believe you are describing.

> Bonnie


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