Re: Brian's need (was) Extropian principles, let's have a look (on Mormons)

From: John M Grigg (
Date: Fri Jun 09 2000 - 04:52:10 MDT

Brian Atkins wrote:
Don't sweat it, you can post a modified version of the principles to your website and identify yourself from now on as a Queenetropian :-).

Am I a Griggtropian then? lol :)

he continued:
Or you can put an asterisk next the word Extropian every time you use it and put a little disclaimer in your sig explaining your specific version of it.

That might be a good idea for EVERYONE on the list!

Brian Atkins wrote:
Everyone has their own view of what it means to be an Extropian. The obvious problem is that the line has to be drawn somewhere. If you have mormons, communists, etc. suddenly saying they believe they are Extropians,
where are we headed then? I think the principles are there to provide some basic level, or backbone, of structure to draw that needed line. And if you fall to the other side of the line, then I don't think you can
reasonably argue that you are an Extropian.

I agree that the extropian principles are there to provide a backbone but people are not asked to swear an oath of allegiance to it. ;) By your logic(which is sound) I am not a true blue extropian but I can live with that. I do like Natasha's view that it is good to be inclusive of others even when they are not in total or even close agreement. To encourage and develop the extropian tendancies that person have is a good strategy.

Mormon extropians... lol! There are contradictions there for sure but also some similarities. As I have said before, I believe in God, church and an afterlife but do not have an absolute sure knowledge. Perhaps I am like Thomas of old.

Extropian concepts of perpetual social and technological progress and personal development in a world that respects the rights of the individual thrill me and are what brings me back. I want a more equal playing field in this life for everyone.

I guess that Mormon influence on the extropians would get noticeable if you all started having two year supplies of food and medicine, a strict health code that all members were expected to obey, strict rules regarding no sex before marriage and only with your partner after it, and missionaries going door to door to share the extropian discussions. Right Brent? :)

Brent, I remember your post well about how the Mormon church has so much money(net worth about 30+ billion I think) and you thought it a waste to be spent in the way the church does on things like missionary work, congregation budgets and meetinghouse and temple building. I think as religious organizations go the money is well spent but I understood your point. And remember, churches often meet real needs of real human beings for love, acceptance, structure and even mates and so they have thrived all over the world.

I look at the military and federal gov't spending and wring my own hands at the waste! Two-hundred million is not much to the gov't but could put into overdrive cryonic and transhumanist efforts.

The thing to remember is that the Mormon people and leadership have spent nearly two centuries now sacrificing and building up what they have with blood, sweat and tears. Those of you familiar with Mormon history from early times up till the present would understand. Transhumanists could in some ways learn from the example set.

This has been an interesting thread and I look forward to feedback. My cat has decided to help me type so I will stop here.


John Grigg

Send FREE Greetings for Father's Day--or any day!
Click here:

This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Thu Jul 27 2000 - 14:12:57 MDT