Re: Things extropians agree on

From: KPJ (
Date: Fri Jan 26 2001 - 08:37:41 MST

It appears as if Charlie Stross <> wrote:
|If you disagree with any of these memes, could you wave a hand and
|explain why?

Yes, I could (and did).

The memes lacked information on WHO did the action.

Did you intend a general moral theory ("ONE SHOULD DO <x>"),
a moral theory for the members of this list ("WE SHOULD DO <x>"),
or what?

|1. Forcing our fellow human beings to live their lives as we see fit
| is unethical. (Persuading them of the error of their ways so that
| they _choose_ to live their lives by our lights is another matter.)

1. One should not force a fellow human how to live their lives.
   (One may persuade them to _choose_ to do that, however.)

[Do we need the "human" part?
 One should also specify the meaning of "persuade":
 some may consider e.g. electric chocks a persuasion method.]

|2. Initiating violence against someone is wrong; self-defense is right.

2. Nobody should initiate violence against anybody else.
   Everone may defend themselves, however.

[This lacks information on what entities constitutes the basic group.
 Thousand years ago one could kill a foreigner as they were not one of us.
 Today we cannot do that, but we can kill and torture chimpanzees.
 A definition on the basic group will make this more obvious.
 If the basic group requires e.g. intelligence, etc., one should state this.]

|3. The scientific method provides a better way of evaluating reality
| than any religious dogma.

3. One should use scientific method instead of religious dogma, since
   we observe that experimental knowledge works better than dogmnatic beliefs.

[Any suggestions?]

|4. Progress (increases in human intelligence, longevity, wealth, and
| happiness) is possible.

4. We can think better, live longer, have more wealth, and a happier life.
   Since we like that, we call it "progress".


|5. Central control is usually less efficient than distributed control.

5. We observe that systems with a centralized control breaks easier than
   those with a distributed control.

[Did you mean this?
 Any unstated presumptions missing?]

|6. Empowering people to learn, work, and transcend their limits is a good
| thing.

6. One should empower people to learn, work, and transcend their limits.

[Did you intend this?]

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